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Forewarning: this is a long post, so if you don't want to read it all, then don't, but don't add any judgmental or ridiculous comments.
I am trying to help come up with solutions, but if I overstep, just let me know, as I tend to do that sometimes.#1 issue: what we are calling leechers, want everything but don't want to share.
I have been a part of many "community" based sites, and this is one of the better ones.
We (using "we" as I am a member on this site) use the most basic foundation setup of a community site; we have points for a currency system and a rank system.
The rank system kind of hurts me a bit. As I move up in rank, I spend my points on what I feel are good assets then my rank goes back down as if I didn't participate on the site, keeping me as a noob or lower-level member.
The points system gives us 50 points login perk now, which is ok, but to rack up points, you must participate or donate, which is also good; the problem is the ones we refer to as "leeching the leechers" only want free stuff without doing their part.
With that being said, here is a possible solution. I know some still won't like it as you can't satisfy everyone!First, to make the rank system something to show status such as a good, fair, and ok active member. We can use badges to build member ranks 1 through whatever, giving us a sense of usefulness. I will show an example of what I am saying shortly. On the same token, you can add a small amount of points per badge to encourage the use and promote the rank/points systems (honesty would also be a factor). This can also encourage participation throughout the other areas of the site, such as the blog, showcase, small to large competitions, and so on.
The badge system would/could be something like this: Just suggestions, not a set-in-stone request.
Member Badges:
Members Badge - Obviously, this would be for everyone that joins the site with the joining points perk at maybe 100 pts for joining and 50 pts per re-up. Use members badge with re-up status. Say I renew three times, then my badge would have something on it reflecting the three re-ups.Filler Badge - This would be for someone who makes a valid fill. There is no need to add a number. Just give the same badge for every fill. It can be worth, say, 10 points per badge plus what they earn on the fill and go towards a small number to boost their rank that stays permanent. This one would promote more people doing more fills even if all they want is to be leechers they may be inticed to do something!
Poster Badge - This would be for posting a public product, not just a private fill. Once again worth some small amount of currency pts and rank points.
Showcase Badge - Obviously, to post artwork. We would need a viewable archive system for this as it can take up a lot of space in the future.
Comms Badge - This would be a simple one for people communicating in the forums and can be used to add to rank or points currency or both. Maybe 2 or 3 comments equals x amount of points toward a Comms Badge. A comment with a certain amount of words can be worth more badge points and so forth.
Admin Badges:
Admin Badge - Obviously means said person is Admin.Helper Badge - To the admins who put forth the effort to help members however possible. Most people don't like to "toot their own horn," but this could be a badge that the members give an admin for successful help or any help at that. This is for the above-and-beyond-duty type of stuff!
Blog Badge - interpret however fits the needs of the community.
Law Badge - The one(s) overall responsible for cracking down and enforcing the rules.
This is just an idea, and don't limit it to "my idea." take it and run with it if it sounds like something you may want to try. I want this site to run for as long as possible, and the best way to do that is to get the members involved and get lots of traffic but stay below the big radar (if possible).
In the future, if the site gets the wrong type of notice from Big Brother or whomever, then it may make sense to turn the "Request" tab into a "Wishlist" tab so the argument can be we are not sharing here, people are just stating the products they wish they can get so prove I am doing something wrong! Just keep it where fills can be made. (Maybe it won't work, but it's worth a shot LOL!)This site has the potential to be so much more than just for sharing and leechers. I, for one, have learned a lot here from many different members, and I am sure I will learn more. You might even be able to add an advice or tutorial section for those who are interested in learning from other artist and their experiences. I know you can find a tutorial for everything on the internet, but I am talking about tips and tricks people figure out on their own that they can share with everyone. Plus, if you belong to a community, you would want to learn from the members and, on the other hand, help/advise/teach other members as well.
Anyway, I think I am done for now. I'll do an edit or another post if I think of anything else that can help push our community forward!
Once again, Admin, you are doing a great job keeping us up and running!
iirc, we used to have different badges someone could earn a few years ago on here. They didn't last.
Only people that should get benefits of any kind are those who constantly share.
The higher your share rank the more perks you get. Ive been over this multiple timesWell Damn!
Maybe it can be set up differently; I believe it could be helpful if used properly. I am not saying it was done wrong before, as that had to of been before my time on here. In my experience, most sites that use badges don't set them up correctly and use them for the wrong things at the wrong time. If the system is set up to focus on particular things, such as each badge worth points toward rank levels or towards point currency, it can work. It would be a trial and error thing, obviously, to get it running correctly.
@ulysses
Do you know why it didn't last? Maybe it wasn't focused on anything, just random badges given out to friends or for saying hi. I have seen that make the badge system crash. Oh well, I'll just have to think of something else.I feel the main focus would be finding a way to get people involved in the rest of the site, and the sharing will straighten up some. Right now, it's booming out of fear of change.
@Adam
My friend, I understand what you are saying, but what about people who can't constantly share? Do we just leave them (me as well) on the roadside to fend for themselves? I mean, this is supposed to be a sharing site, right? This goes back to why I mentioned people involved in other parts of the site.Yes, at the moment, there are so many items/products and such that can be put back on this site, and old ones that didn't make it can be added, but eventually, the old items will be mainly replenished, and what's left, new items that still have to be bought. I am looking at the long term here.
Do we leave it to the few constant fillers/sharers? Hell no! That's not what I mean at all!
The badges are not meant to be seen as perks but as incintitive to more sharing from more people. Let's say at work, you are getting complacent and dragging a bit. Either the boss fires you and loses an experienced workforce, or they try to find a way to get you back on track. The first option may be something a fast-paced production warehouse might do, but the second option is a sign of a good leader. I'm sure this argument will get cut to pieces but it takes someone with a bit of creativity and foresight to fix instead of eliminate.
This will be the last defense for my idea, but the idea is out there for a review of a possible solution or a start for one.
Don't take this personally. I don't intend to offend, just to voice my thoughts and to protect something I enjoy.Back to the drawing board!
Oh, and one other thing: if I can get someone to show me how to extract from my library, I have some things that can be posted on the site.
Only people that should get benefits of any kind are those who constantly share.
The higher your share rank the more perks you get. Ive been over this multiple times
@d0gg0d, you are correct. But alas, we are ignored. I've been saying it since the original Zelin thread. Don't know why we haven't tried this, it seems to make perfect sense (at least to me).@Adam @ulysses
I say we test this (Rank trumps) and see how it goes. One way to know for sure is to do it and iron out the wrinkles as we go. I may lose here, but I vote for what the community wants to try. I just have to find a way to boost my rank, then.I know it's not up to us. I'm just saying I will go with the flow and try to survive the initial injury. As you get used to the pain, it has lesser effects on you.
You are NOT entitled to an endless stream of items for nothing. I'm NOT expected to feed, cloth or house you, so don't expect me to supply your hobbies. Contribute or leave. Sharing is supposed to be a two way street.
@Ethiopia
I agree and I think the intent for a reasonable solution is to get them people involved in contributing to the sharing so the ones that flat out do nothing can be weeded out. At least that is what I got the impression of hence my ideas. The ones that don't move forward will be pushed out. Kind of brings us towards a private sharing community .Adam's idea is interesting in my eyes. As he said, not everyone has the financial means to buy things on a regular basis.
But there are some people here that are active in the fora, or like me post regular "art"works, in that section.
This site is more than a place to get content, witch makes it stand out.
So being active should hold some merit.
How,what,where is a different discussion.If it would be "just"a sharing site, we might as well get rid of the whole forum bit.
But I have met some nice people here, who were helpful when in need of advice, giving pointers on improving my work.I do agree on the old adagio "sharing is caring" though, and it does work.My balance gone up over night with20K points for filling requests, and filled request now on all post page.
I do not care about the points ( I got plenty) but,with one single item I got 400 days of login points in one goSimple things.
Example only
-Say rank 5 doesn't have to wait for held releases. They get instant access.
-Rank 4 may have to wait 1 week instead of 4. Ect...
-Say max rank gets a discount. 25 instead of 50 to DL but the poster still gets full points.
-Max rank can attach a signature in their posts. Ect... I've rehashed this multiple times.
It doesn't have to be something site breaking or anything that makes people feel excluded. Look at my rank. Im lvl 1 and yet im batting for people with a million points.
The site is dead without sharing. Why not make people feel good about doing it. Give them a goal to reach that has a benefit more meaningful than an icon.
If all I have to do is log in and leech what incentives do I have?
Mods gave up running contests. That was an incentive for the community to interact and post art. Look back a few years and youll see an entire forum dedicated to posting winners.
This subject is a horse thats been beaten and dragged around every year to get resurrected and beaten to death again and again.
Now, this makes more sense. Now I understand why the older members say, "let rank trump" and I now agree 90%. My problem with that is I do share and make fills when I am able to, and I have no problem with that, but that's where I would like to hit at least a rank that's not 1. Maybe cap at 2 or 3 to show I share but at a lower level or rate. Does that make sense?
All I needed was to get someone to throw out ideas that showed past issues as opposed to current problems. I asked what was going on before, but no one wanted to say. People just wanted to gripe about lower-than-low leeching but didn't want to say what has been attempted or an idea of what might work. Now, this is the first time I heard something other than "I have been saying something... etc." or "I told you so."
Beating the horse into a puddle is sometimes needed till someone says this is what we did. This is what happened. It could have saved me from throwing out ideas that have already been done, as I do want to see this site continue to exist.
To me, this is the first I have heard about any of this because I started as one of those lower-than-low leechers till I realized it wasn't right what I was doing, and I should be attempting to share what I could. Then, I started paying attention to what was going on here. At the same time, I started asking for and receiving help in learning the ins and outs of DAZ and lighting scenes.
I think your frustration with me is the communication on this subject isn't happening as the older members already did this several times and newer members, well, just don't know and think we want to help, but as I said, just don't know.
I apologize if I reopened old wounds! In this case, made more on top of others, LOL!
This whole discussion is hilarious.
There is a site, that gives "points" for visiting daily. And when people have gained some points (let's say about 40.000 or so), the go and tell the people "oh we are sorry, there are so much fake accounts, we have to stop the point system.
WTF?
I mean - if you run a site with giving points, then give points for good sake.
OR: Don't offer it first!
And for all those who are saying, it is a need......how do others run their sites?
They have popups or other advertising things to gain money.
For the point "fake-accounts": having 40.000 points for visiting this site for over 2 years means my account is FAKE???? Really?
Does this mean, i have to spent the points for useless stuff, i don*t need? Or is it possible to spare them for upcoming things mor useful?
My decision to quit my account at the time i have spent all my remaining points, is fixed.
There are so many sites out there, where we can get the same stuff, without any stupid "point-system". But it was a motivation for me, to visit this site daily - but now....Why wait? Just give your points away and move on to the other sites. If you're trying to make a statement, then make one.
Why? Because it's a fraud to offer something, that you don't give then.
And a statement isn't what i'm up too.
Just saying, it's not OK.
Why all the other sites run, without permanetly beging for some money-donate. They do it with advertise, or else.......and, by the way: if some stuff is SO importand, that i REALLY need it - i buy it.
Making a site with "free-stuff", has to be FREE! Google the word, if you don't know the meaning.
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